Episode 13 - Full Transcript

 

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Welcome to the show

Piers Townley: Hello and welcome to the Charity show, the podcast for Charity Insiders by Charity Insiders. Please rate, follow or subscribe to us on your usual podcast platform. And here's what's coming up in episode 13.

Tim Beynon: It's going to be interesting to see what the ripple effect of Trump's second term is going to be for the Charity sector over there, for the Charity sector over here and around the world. What do charities, you know, like environmental charities, refugee charities, women's charities, charities who, you know, charities over here who work a lot with the us. What are they going to be, the implications for them? How do they feel about it?

Saskia Konynenburg: The challenge with National Insurance, uplifts at the moment is we've done some calculations, some quick calculations, so we can see that this will cost the sector, 1.4 billion between 25 and 26. And obviously charities are now already worried about what their finances are going to be like for next year. So even if you're a small charity, even to the much larger charities, like, this is a, this is a cost that perhaps we haven't budgeted or we didn't realise was coming.

Tracey Anne-Breese: There are more and more challenge events being created. Some of them are charity owned, some of them are mass participation, you know, some of them are third party suppliers that are doing, you know, overseas treks and things like. And it's, you know, it's about finding the right event for your charity and there's, you know, there's different ways you can go about it and it's going to be different for every charity.

Tim Beynon: You go to more black tie dos than James Bond Piers.

Piers Townley: I used to go to more website. Yeah, as we were talk. Talked about earlier, too many late nights. Can't do late nights anymore, so as long as they finish at a decent time.

The US election and the Budget

Hello and welcome to episode 13 of the Charity show with me, Piers Townley, PR manager at the Brain Tumour Charity.

Tim Beynon: And me, Tim Beynon, head of marketing engagement at the firefighters Charity.

Piers Townley: Well, it's been quite a couple of weeks, Tim, all in all. And as we record this, it's only a few days after a, ah, historic US election and a week or so after the UK budget. What have you made of it all?

Tim Beynon: Yeah, we've got to be careful. It's not a politics show, this. We've got to be a little bit careful. But, yeah, what a. What a couple of weeks has been, eh? What a. What a tumultuous time.

Will Donald Trump's second term impact charities around the world?

I mean, the US election doesn't really. Well, it does, doesn't. It? Doesn't affect us in this show. But it's going to be interesting to talk about it a little bit. You know, the fact that Donald Trump has made it into, his second term, despite his, you know, ongoing dramas, something that made, has made me really sort of think, this week. I used to work for nacro, the crime reduction Charity. And during that time when I was there, on a daily basis, we used to hear the stories of, of, of people who had, criminal convictions and were, were struggling to find work as a result. not so in America, it appears. You can have 34, convictions, and you can become President of the United States. So quite, quite spectacular. I couldn't. I really, really can't believe that that's the case. That someone with a, with record literally is able to achieve the highest office in the land, which is amazing. But it's going to be interesting to see what the ripple effect of Trump's second term is going to be for the Charity sector over there, for the Charity sector over here and around the world. And it's interesting looking at his stand on certain policies and certain things. What do charities, you know, like environmental charities, refugee charities, women's charities, charities over here who work a lot with, with the us, what are they going to be, the implications for them, how do they feel about it? and, you know, do we need to worry, or will they be worrying about the impact of Trumpism and MAGA and all that that stands for? Will that impact us over here and charities over here really, really keen to hear from people about that. So if you do have a view, get in touch with us through the links in the show notes. Tell us what you think. Are you worried? Is it going to impact your day to day, your Charity day today? Fascinating subject. Let's, let's hear from, hear from people who have an opinion on that would be great.

Fire Fighters Charity team nominated for Charity Comms Inspiring Communicator Award

In other news, just for me personally, really great week for us. The marketing engagement team at the firefighters Charity has been nominated, and shortlisted for the, Charity Comms Inspiring Communicator Award in the category of Best in House Campaigns. This is as, a result of the incredible work that my team, did and I'm not going to take any credit for it at all. It's amazing work that my team, did, to support the launch of the Charity Suicide Crisis Line, last November. A huge impact, very powerful stuff that the team did, and it's really made a difference. And over the last year we've seen how successful is the wrong word, but we've seen what an impact the line has had, and how many lives it has potentially saved. So very, very proud of the team for that. So, yeah, big week for us. Even bigger week, arguably for the world in terms of Trump and everything. But what have you made of all beers?

Piers Townley: Oh, just first, Eaton, congratulations. Because we did, I know, before offline, we've spoken about all the work that your team was doing on the suicide line and stuff. So richly deserve the nomination. Fingers crossed

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Piers Townley: for you and, for the Charity itself. For that, Trump has blindsided me. I think we're still going through the implications personally, as a charity, possibly as, you know, as a state of the nation as well. Who knows how the ripples of this world fan out. And there's a cliche about, you know, sneezing here and everyone else catching the cold everywhere else. You know, it's a huge, it's a huge thing. It's a huge thing. And, events, I think will start to unfold, or not start to unfold, will start to develop really, really quickly and the implications, some of which we can know about, but there's plenty around the corner I think might trip us up. And for the, you know, the third sector and the economy of this country, it could all have a, knock on effect, or they will have a knock on effect. I think it's just the sheer numbers, Tim. If you think about it, tens and tens of millions of people looked at those candidates and decided to choose the choice that they did, which is mind boggling. It is just mind boggling. Yeah. So back over in the uk, obviously we're working through the implications of the budget and what it will have in effect for the third sector for fundraising, for strategy, for economic models of many, many charities. And this will lead us on to the interview we have with Saskia Kananberg as she talks through the petition that's been launched by the National Council for Voluntary Organisations has been sent off to the Treasury, I think, at the time of recording. And then Saskia will talk more about this. Thousands of charities have signed up to this, so we'll monitor that very, very closely and we'll feed back and maybe get Saskia back on the show to see the developments as the months go on.

Music Industry Trusts Awards honoured Jason Illey this year

In other news, in my own news, I was very, very fortunate to attend this year's MYTHS Awards and that stands for the Music Industry Trusts Awards Awards on Monday nights where Jason Ily, who is the current CEO of Sony uk, was honoured this year. And those awards, they celebrate various music personalities, and movies and shakers. And this year it was Jason's career over the last few decades, the last 10 years actually at the helm of Sony in particular and the incredible acts he's worked with and supported, the musicians he has helped nurture. but it's interesting that Sony has also worked with the Charity Mind and spearheaded by Jason's involvement as well, to invest heavily into mental health training for employees, among other workplace and industry initiatives. But interestingly from a Charity point of view, the MITS has also raised 7 million for two brilliant charities, the Brick Trust that offers opportunities to young people of all backgrounds and Nordhoff and Robbins, which people may know of, which is the UK's largest music therapy charity. So two amazing charities that were supported on a star studded events, you know, the likes of Paloma Faith, Mark Monson and Brit Trust, student, well Brit Trust talent Kat Burns performed and gave some speeches and there was a well trodden silent auction fundraiser that is often at these sort of events and he just saw donations rocket throughout the night for the two great charities for the Brit Trust and the Nordoff and Robbins, which is a shout out to them. So yeah, a really interesting evening.

Tim Beynon: Amazing. Sounds amazing. You go to more black tie dues than James Bond, Pierce.

Piers Townley: I used to go to more birth sign. Yeah. Ah, as we were talking, talked about earlier, too many late nights, can't do late nights anymore. So as long as they finish at a decent time.

Tim Beynon: Nice, nice.

Piers Townley: But yeah, that was a real honour to do that and to see those two amazing charities.

Saskia is back to talk about the impact of the Budget and National Insurance Contributions

Tim Beynon: Excellent, excellent, fascinating stuff about Saskia as well, which I think we should probably lead into. So here's an interview that we recorded with Saskia a little earlier on this week when the petition and the open letter that they talked to Saskia about had reached about the 2000 signatory, signatory mark. Since then and since this recording, since this interview, I think that has passed well beyond the 5,000 mark. So incredible, incredible, numbers that have signed that letter. But here is Saskia's take on the budget. Saskia, welcome back to the Charity show. It's great to see you again. Great to have you back on the show, becoming a familiar face now, which is great. Fantastic to see you again. We want to talk to you today a little bit about the autumn budget from last week. Now NCVO and Akiva have joined forces and you guys are calling upon charities across the country to come together to sign an open letter to the Chancellor in the wake of the budget. can you sort of summarise for Us why this issue of increased employer national insurance contributions is potentially so important and so dangerous and so, significant for the sector.

Saskia Konynenburg: I don't think it will come as any surprise to anyone that the Charity sector has gone through a couple of years of real turbulence, and we call it a triple threat. So we're seeing higher demand for our services, rising costs and also lower funding. So anything that impacts our, finances at the moment obviously can be really detrimental. I think the challenge with national insurance, uplifts at the moment is we've done some calculations, some quick calculations, and we can see that this will cost the sector A, 1.4 billion between 25 and 26. And obviously,

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Saskia Konynenburg: charities are now already worried about what their finances are going to be like for next year. So even if you're a small charity, even to the much larger charities, like, this is a, this is a cost that perhaps we haven't budgeted or we didn't realise was coming. So that will come into force. From 1 April, people are looking at their budgets now going, where am I going to get that, money from? I already. We're already squeezed. We're already thinking, can we afford to employ a new person to do this, that and the other? I speak to CEOs all the time who are CEO, come finance manager, come HR manager. So, you know, charities are already extremely squeezed. We're not sure how they'll be able to afford this.

Tim Beynon: And, this is exactly budget time, isn't it? It's this time of the year, then people and charities are looking at those budgets for 25, 26. So you think this impact 1.4 billion is going to be something that people need to consider now for their budgets for next year?

Saskia Konynenburg: Yeah, I mean, we're doing all we can to campaign and say that charities need to be exempt from this or at least get reimbursed for this. But there is no golden ticket. It's something that all charities need to be considering now, how will we afford this? And, from our members that have contacted us, the only way people think they can afford this is through cuts. And whether that's staffing cuts or cuts to services or closing buildings, these are all the real challenging decisions that charities are going to have to make.

Any increases in budget to charities at this stage will ultimately mean cuts to services

Tim Beynon: So you just absolutely answered my next question for me. But I was going to say, so, any kind of cost implication, any sort of increases in budget to charities at this stage, ultimately, this means cuts to either services and. Or to jobs.

Saskia Konynenburg: Yeah. We have had the most contact since the pandemic over this issue, our telephones, our emails, people even contacting me on X and LinkedIn, and Sarah Elliott over the weekend from our members just to say, what are we going to do about this? How can we afford. Doesn't government know how already we're in such crisis like this is will push many people over the edge, you know, and it's not just a small Charity issue, it's not just a large Charity issue. Any Charity that is employing people will face this challenge down and think how on earth were we able to afford this?

Saskia says reaction from charity sector was one of outrage

Piers Townley: And M, was the general, was the general reaction Saskia from the members, one of just panic or was it kind of this is coming down the line. We have to then take a measured approach to this. What sort of reactions did you, did you get from the sector?

Saskia Konynenburg: I think the main reaction from the sector, was one of outrage really. And you know, this is a Charity sector which is there through thick and thin. We already deliver so much on behalf of the state. We actually step in probably where the state should at times. You know, we are feeding people, we are helping people through poverty, we are making sure that women and girls are protected from violence, we are housing people. We are doing absolutely all we can to keep communities going. We are filling gaps when public services have had to be stripped back to the absolute core. mental health support, all these things that, you know, society needs to continue. Charities are there and are doing it. So to put further financial burden on charities who are already completely overwhelmed and overstretched is really tough. And it's a really hard message for us to all take because we think we're trying to work in really good partnership. We're doing absolutely all we can. But yeah, to hear this news I think has become as it's, you know, it's really, it's a real test to us, like, you know, how can you, how can some of us just keep going through this? How many knocks can you have?

Piers Townley: And as you said, as you pointed out, it's going to affect all charities no matter their size or scope really. And at the time of us talking, there's over 2, 000 charities that have signed up to the letter. I guess it's a self explanatory question. Were you surprised by the reaction or was it that this is what's going to be happening?

Saskia Konynenburg: We even had a surge over the weekend which I think indicates that, you know, people who work in the voluntary sector don't ever stop. So we're now over 4,000 signatures so I think this issue is just so important to people. They know that this is going to lead to some real binary decisions that they don't want to make. we've already planned, we're planning, what can we do next year anyway to try and stay afloat. Now I've been hit by this and I need to find an extra £10,000, £50,000. Several charities are looking at bills of millions of pounds to, you know, to find. Where do you find that from?

Tim Beynon: Yeah, it's, it's a, it's. Yeah, it's a awful dilemma for charities to be facing. I remember, Saskia, when you were on the show, a couple of months ago, and we were talking about the impact of a change of governments, and what's, you know, what that. I think it was actually just before the election, even maybe that we spoke so a little while ago and we're talking about, you know, the mood in terms of a potential change of government and you were talking, we're talking quite positively about, you know, what the potential might be. Did this come from left field? Was this a genuine surprise?

Saskia Konynenburg: Well, we had already written, we did know that there was this kind

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Saskia Konynenburg: of might be on the card. So with our sister councils, we had already written to, the treasurer to say, you know, what a challenge national insurance uplift or any, you know, additional taxes on the Charity sector would have and NCVO and in kivo, we're never quiet about how much the Charity sector is facing times of challenge at the moment and what support we need. I think we are still really positive that we can make progress with having a really good relationship with government. We have already built some really strong relationships and we're working on the covenant and that's a really exciting partnership. One of the key parts of the covenant, though, is building a strong and diverse and independent civil society. And, within that, we have to be able to challenge and drive sound decision making. So if we think that the government makes a decision that obviously impacts us negatively or causes some sort of further, challenge further down the line, then it's our kind of responsibility to raise that. So we're not campaigning to say the government is completely wrong. We totally see the need for investment. We are calling out for investment in public services. We totally see the need to invest in preventative work. But there is a challenge in that. Investing in preventative work will take a long time for the impact to be realised. And at the moment, we are dealing with communities in crisis. As I say, we're dealing with children who don't have beds in their rooms, families who don't have homes and are living in hotels, you know, children going about meals. it's like the situation is absolutely terrible. you kind of can't front load one way and then withhold the other end where the charities are trying to support those people. So I suppose we're, we're trying to outline that this is a really serious and really worrying situation through the letter.

Tim Beynon: you did also point out in there as well, of course that there was some good news that came out of the budget in terms of the fact that, the Chancellor laid out the government's commitment to increasing investment in local government, in send provision and in housing, which in the longer term should relieve some of the pressure on charities that have been, in the short term, plugging some of those gaps.

Saskia Konynenburg: the Treasurer has the most unenviable job, I think, in terms of how on earth we can get, Britain UK working again in the way it needs to. And there's so many challenges and we do fully recognise that investment in our communities is massively needed. Public services are on their knees. All of these kind of things, even the support around people and universal credit and carers allowance are all really, really beneficial. But that doesn't mean that at the same time we have to further put challenge on charities because it needs to be a partnership and things like public service investment. So, 600 million for, social care. That's absolutely fantastic. Will it flow through into charities? We really hope it will. you know, so many social care providers are charities, so we really hope that there's some, you know, on a knock on positive effect for that. But we also know that local authorities are in absolute financial turmoil as well. So, you know, this is a really, really difficult situation to try and navigate.

Tim Beynon: Yeah. And you, I remember last time you were on the show again, you talked about the importance of partnership and the importance of having, having a seat at the table to have those conversations. On the matter of national Insurance contributions, have you had any indication from the government at all that they are listening, that, that maybe you will be invited to take that seat at the table to have these conversations? Or is it still too early days perhaps for, that to have happened?

Saskia Konynenburg: So we have got a meeting in the diary with Steph Peacock, Charities, Minister, which has come off the back of, obviously she's seen our work on the National Insurance, challenge and she's asked for a meeting with us to really try and understand it more so that hopefully she will speak to the treasurer and then get those conversations moving. There's never any guarantees. It's not easy for the government to work out how to muddle through some of these challenges. They do need to tax organisations, they do need to tax people, they need to get money so that they can properly invest in this country. So we totally recognise all of that. We just think it's really important that we can outline what the knock on effect of that might be. So, you know, if you want to invest in, for example, public service delivery because you want to, I don't know, reduce something that's impacting the community and try and alleviate poverty, that's absolutely fine. But what about the Charity that is actually providing that crisis poverty work intervention now? What about the Charity that is running that food bank? If that gets withdrawn, then that's a lifeline withdrawn from the community. So you have to look at it in the full circle. So that's what we're going to hopefully, have that conversation with Stephanie Peacock this week and keep our fingers crossed that that message really goes right into the heart of government and drilling down.

Piers Townley: That message as well.

NCVO has launched an open letter urging charities to sign up

Saskia, it's a well worn phrase, but what does success look like from the letter? What is it ultimately that you want to achieve?

Saskia Konynenburg: We would hope that there's

00:20:00

Saskia Konynenburg: two things that we can achieve. The ultimate would be obviously for charities to be reimbursed for any margin insurance uplifts that they need to do. we deliver £17 billion worth of public services. So we know public services have been exempt from this. Is that something that could happen for charities as well? But there are charities that don't deliver public services that are also really filling gaps when there are gaps in public service delivery or things have been tightened too much. So we can't forget those charities as well. So I think the other thing that we would look at is just making the operating environment for charities better and easier. Looking at all sorts of our funding mechanisms. What levers can government pull to help with some of that? And all the things that NCVO and Akivo laid out in our manifesto around, you know, contract uplifts, fair, deals, philanthropy, all these things that we could, you know, really do with some help on, which would make charities less vulnerable when shakes like this happen. In the meantime, we'll be continuing our work on the Covenant, which we're consulting on at the moment, and really hope that charities will participate in that and say what they need from their relationship with government and, you know, really building that strong and diverse sector that, that can take shakes and knocks, you know, isn't it doesn't automatically mean that we lurch to. We're in complete crisis and we're probably going to have to close. Like what can make the charity sector and the voluntary sector really sustainable for the future and we would desperately want government's help with that.

Piers Townley: And where can charities go, Saskia, to get involved? Where can the call to action to sign the open letter? How can a charity doom go about that?

Saskia Konynenburg: So the open letter is on the NCVO website and there's a form so you can fill it straight in there and share it as well. Share the letter with your friends, your charity sector colleagues. Get as many, you know, organisations as possible aware of this situation. I imagine that, you know, there's probably quite a few charity leaders out there now completely panicked and worried and thinking how on earth are we going to do this? So as well as obviously signing the letter which is taking action, start preparing and thinking about what you might need to do come 1st of April. And obviously NCVO has a huge amount of resources that can help charities with that financial budget planning.

Tim Beynon: Fantastic. Saskia, thank you so much for joining us. I really appreciate you taking time out of your very busy day. Lots going on at the moment. So thank you so much for joining us and taking time to do so. We wish you all the very best of luck with it and would welcome you to come back onto the show and tell us how it goes in perhaps a few weeks time.

Saskia Konynenburg: Thank you, I'd love to.

Tim Beynon: Great to speak to South Gear and plenty for us to be thinking about there in terms of the budget and its implications for the sector, for every Charity if everyone listening, listening to the show. So while I think that might have pretty much taken up our regular news slot peers in which we usually talk about what's going on.

Kevin Donaghy has written a book called Stories of Cancer and Hope

we've also heard this week from Kevin Donaghy who got in touch to tell us about an inspirational book that he's written. So it's called Stories of Cancer and Hope and it's a collection of personal essays from people directly affected by cancer. It's born from the idea, of asking individuals to share their stories and what hope means or meant to them. the book offers an honest and inspirational look at different lived experiences of the disease spanning from the initial diagnosis to the profound impact of treatments on emotional and physical wellbeing. Something I know quite well personally as well, as well of course as its effects, on loved ones compiled by an extraordinary writer in Kevin. an amazing guy who himself is living with an incurable and life limiting melanoma diagnosis. Each storyteller in the book highlights the issues, emotions and reality of having or being affected by a wide range of cancers. Contributions come from all over the UK and feature some inspirational stories of everyday people. From the ultra marathon runner who urges people to live life to the fullest, and the nurse who supported her patients through treatment. To the partners, parents and siblings who remember the loved ones they've very sadly lost to the disease. The book has been created with the help of Kevin's friends and family. and Kevin is supporting through the sale of the book, Maggie's Cancer Charity, with at least one pound from the sale of each book being donated to help those living with cancer and their families. So it's an incredible book by an incredible author, which I'm more. Which we're both more than happy to shout about here on the show. and yeah, what do you think, Piers? Amazing guy and an amazing book.

Piers Townley: Yes, he is, Tim. You're an amazing guy.

Win a copy of Stories of Cancer and Hope

And the Brain Tumour Charity, we know Kevin, he features Nicola Nuttall in the book and she's talking about her incredible daughter, Laura Nuttall, who sadly died from a glioblastoma Brain Tumour last year aged just 23. But you know, Laura had achieved so much and was an incredible advocate and supporter of the Brain Tumour Charity and she was one of our young ambassadors as well. And she sh. She remains, her legacy, remains a shining light in the community, A huge legacy and sorely missed. And so thank you Kevin for featuring Laura's story and also featuring her mum, a lovely mum, Nicola, in the book.

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Tim Beynon: Yeah, and thanks, thanks Kevin for getting in touch. And Kevin's also given us a copy of Stories of Cancer and Hope to give away, which is really, really kind of him. all you need to do, just head to the show notes and our various social channels for details of how you can enter the draw to win it. All we want to do is, is just pick a name out of the hat, simple as that. but all we ask in return really is if you are lucky enough to, to win the book, think, about honouring Kevin's wishes and maybe give a donation, give what you can to Maggie's candid Charity in return. I think that would be a nice touch. So you can find out that on the socials and in the show notes and you can find out more about the book itself at his website. The link to which we'd also put in the show notes, as well.

This week we take a closer look at challenge events with Tracey Anne-Breese

Piers Townley: this week we're going to take a closer look at challenge events and the incredible feats that fundraisers across the country routinely put themselves through. Whether it's climbing mountains, taking on triathlons or pogos sticking the length of the country. Our, guest in this episode knows a thing or two about challenge events, having taken part in a vast array of self over many years. Indeed, Tracy Ambries, is so passionate about challenge events that she set up her own business to ensure charities of all sizes are able to embrace the fundraising opportunities that can come from these challenge events. So, always up for challenge ourselves, Tim and I caught up with Tracy to find out how we can all push ourselves that little bit further and wage a huge amount more.

Tim Beynon: Hi, Tracy, thank you so much for joining us here on the Charity show. It's great to see you. Great to welcome you onto the show. We're going to be talking today about, challenge events, and how charities should be, running more challenge events and getting more involved in that side of fundraising. and also, of course, what you're doing to help them.

How do you define a challenge event?

but first of all, perhaps you should tell us how you define a challenge event. Are we talking about Everest climbs here, or are we talking about a gentle walk in the countryside? Are we talking about something in the middle? How do you define a challenge? Eventually?

Tracey Anne-Breese: I'm not sure you can, really, to be honest. Anything that gets the heart rate going, I guess, and puts you a little bit out of your comfort zone. So, I mean, I tend to think about, you know, walking, hiking, cycling, running, but then things like abseiling and. Yeah, you know, if you're up for Mount Everest, then that's fantastic. If a challenge for you is a mile down the road, you know, then that still applies.

Tim Beynon: Yeah, absolutely. We've seen that. We've seen a huge variety of different sort of those kind of challenge events. I mean, especially during lockdown, people seem to challenge themselves to all kinds of different, different things. It seemed to. They seem to take lockdown as a challenge to discover challenge, events of their own. So that's really interesting.

Tracey Anne-Breese: Well, it definitely got us all outside more, didn't it?

Tim Beynon: It did. As one. One positive to take from it. and I'm assuming because we're talking and because of, what I know you've. You've been up to in terms of, the, business you've been setting up, that challenge events have always been a really big part of your Life?

Tracey Anne-Breese: Well, not always, no. Since about, since for about 25 years. and something happened in my personal life and it made me realise I needed to get fitter and I wanted to raise money for a certain charity, et cetera. So, yeah, so I started, you know, with a 5k M jumped out of an aeroplane and it just kind of went from there, really. You know, half marathons and various other events. and I just realised how much I got out of them on a personal level. and the experiences that I was having as I wanted to share that then with other people.

Tim Beynon: Are you an adrenaline junkie?

Tracey Anne-Breese: it depends. Not, perhaps not so much now. I think I went through a phase, now. No, I try and keep it a little bit more realistic these days.

Piers Townley: I think that generally, generally happens as you get a bit older, doesn't it?

Tracey Anne-Breese: Yeah.

Piers Townley: I like the idea of some of these challenge events. The reality is very, very different. But at, the Brain Tuber Charger, we've seen so many. I mean we started off with marathons and it was tough mudders and then everyone wanted to do something more. So it was the ultras and then it snowed them by nightfall or then it's trekking up, you know, upside down in the dark with the blindfold on or whatever it is. So over the 20, 25 years, Tracy, you must have seen so many different and taken part in so many different events. It's a two part question really. What was the pick of those events? What's the standout one for you over those years? And has there ever been a challenge event that has kind of defeated you?

Tracey Anne-Breese: so people that know me will be sick of hearing about the nine mega marches because that is the one challenge that really, I said at the end of it, it's a four day event. it started off as a military, event 100 and something years ago. And you can now do four days. I did 50k a day for four days, to get a medal, which is, accredited by the Dutch royal family. I've got Dutch heritage. So when I saw this event I thought I really need to do it. I say it's a four day event. It was 50k day, so 200 days, 200 kilometres in total. And I said at the end of that event that my CV and all of the work experience,

00:30:00

Tracey Anne-Breese: this was back in 2009 that I did it, I was going to rip up because I'd learned more about myself during that four days than anything else had ever taught me.

Tim Beynon: M and what about the one that, as Pier said, is there, I mean, any that have defeated you? Any of you thrown in the town?

Tracey Anne-Breese: Oh, I mean, yeah, it was a 50k that I signed up for locally and I got. I wasn't prepared for it. I wasn't physically or mentally prepared for it. And I got to 16K and just went, I can't carry on. and so. Yeah, and so pulled out of that. I've done a 50k since then. Ah, just this weekend, just gone. Don't know what it was that, I wasn't feeling it that day, M. So, yeah, yeah, it just got the better of me.

Are there any key elements that make an event a success

Piers Townley: So, thinking about, your experience and the business, the new business that you set up, Tracy, and all the events that you've done over the years, are there any key elements of those kind of events? If there's a variety of them, are there key elements that have made a success? You know, is it the organisation, is it the support, is it the people that actually take part in it? And is there something that can go across any event, really, in terms of. That's what's made it a good event?

Tracey Anne-Breese: I think there's loads. To be honest, I don't think I could. I could tell you all of them now. I think a factor and what. When I was organising, because obviously I ran a business previously for 12 years, which was creating challenge events and working with loads of different charities to, put on events for their supporters. And what we always said was, you know, we can put every. We can plan these events to within an inch of their life, you know, put everything into them. But actually, you never really know what's going to happen until people start arriving and then it's the people that are taking part and, you know, their, enthusiasm, their motivation, their, positivity, you know, and that's all contributing to that event. But, yeah, obviously, you know, it needs to be well organised because people need to feel, I think I put a post out the other day and it said, you know, every. Every individual that signs up for your challenge event has put their trust in you. And that is a big deal because they, you know, they want to arrive and feel confident and safe. and, you know, that all then contributes to the positivity and whatever that they're bringing along.

Piers Townley: So I guess a lot of people, we have this a lot as well. So they've had a. They've had. They've met the Charity through a certain set of circumstances and one of these events might be the first time in their lives that they've done it. So obviously that trust has got to be paramount to them, hasn't it? Whereas you've got other people who, you know, run half marathons every other day or whatever, and they just want it to be well organised. So I guess it's just, as you say, it's just working out how each event works, really.

Tracey Anne-Breese: Yeah. And what each individual needs. And I know that's a lot for charities. you know, I used to like to say I'd like to hold each person's hand, whoever needed it, that had signed up for those events, because sometimes they just need that reassurance from somebody you know, and they'll phone. Phone you up and ask you questions. And those questions, you might assume that those questions have already been answered or you might have sent those answers out in an email or a Facebook post or whatever. But if they're not getting it, they're not getting it and they need that bit of extra support. And, yeah, like you say, if they've not done anything like that before, their motivation is to do it for that particular Charity that means an awful lot to them, you know, and you need to do what you can to make that successful for them so that they can go home with fantastic memories and know that they've been able to support that cause that means so much to them.

Tim Beynon: Tracy, can you tell us a little bit about. So tell us a bit about Challenge. Challenge, Challenge event experts. So your business, how did that come about? How did you go from being someone who takes part in Challenge events and clearly gets a huge amount from them, to someone who makes a career out of that and wants to help charities to optimise the, potential of Challenge events. How did you segue from one to the other?

Tracey Anne-Breese: well, I've always enjoyed event management. It's always something that I've kind of done. and I worked for a Charity back in 2000. That's when I first got involved in the Charity sector. And, you know, I was organising all different kinds of events. I left there to go and do a business, degree. Coming out of there thinking, actually, I think I'm almost unemployable because I've got all this generic experience from the Charity, you know, really wide reaching and then a business and. But I knew that I wanted to support charities that was. And particularly, you know, smaller charities. I knew that it had to be something to do with events and then. And I knew, obviously, that I enjoy taking part in Challenge events. And then I met my husband who was an outdoor person. He's now a mountain leader, expedition leader. And it was like, well, if I'm going to set up this business, then that's where I need to go. So it needs to be events, you know, outdoor challenge events that support charities. And that kind of ticked a lot of boxes then. But there's, you know, there was no courses on challenge event management I could do. There was no, nobody I really, I knew to ask. so

00:35:00

Tracey Anne-Breese: we just kind of, you know, learned as we went along. As I literally boots on the ground, I knew what I wanted to get out of a challenge event, you know, so I could put that into, creating events. and then we did that for 12 years. Obviously, Covid had a big thing to say about outdoor challenge events. and things changed as they do, and I thought, well, I've got all this experience now. There are still no particular courses on challenge event management. so actually I can provide a platform that gives all of that information. So it's m. A place where people that want to organise challenge events, fundraise through challenge events, have got somewhere to go to find the resources that they need, any training that they might need, support, mentoring, et cetera. And, so that's where how the platform came about, really.

Tim Beynon: Sure. So tell me about the business model then. How does it work for charities then? Are you essentially like an outsourced events team? If you like, then. So if Charity hasn't got a small Charity pass, doesn't have that in house capability, they can come to you and you can help them to get to grips with what they want to do. Is that how it works?

Tracey Anne-Breese: Yeah, I mean, yes, it can, you know, I'm quite happy to coach or actually, you know, provide hands on, support, but it's also so that charities can learn. And again, you know, it does apply to bigger charities, but they have got bigger teams and more resources. you know, the smaller charities that might not have a designated challenge event fundraiser, but their events fundraiser, you know, wants to look at, or just their fundraising team wants to look at challenge events. where can we go? What can we do? How do we go about it? What resource do? Right. What internal resources do we need? What external resources do we need? Where do we go to find the information, you know, and all that kind of thing. So, so one. Yeah, so one place where they can go. One person they can come to.

Piers Townley: One stop, a one stop shop.

Saskia Konynenburg: Yeah.

Tracey Anne-Breese: And there's a lot, you know, there's a lot that we'll just kind of Work, figure out together as we go along.

Piers Townley: so what, so do you think that's what some of the charities who maybe not contemplate, these sort of events, are doing wrong? Is it just that they're a bit, they just wouldn't, don't know where to start or what is it, what is the common mistakes you've sort of seen in other charities when they try to do these sort of events?

Tracey Anne-Breese: I think, I don't know if I'd want to call them mistakes, but sometimes it's just identifying the right opportunity. I think the important thing with challenge events, there are more and more challenge events being created. Some of them are charity owned, some of them are mass participation. You know, some of them are third party suppliers that are doing, you know, overseas treks and things like, and it's, you know, it's about finding the right event for your Charity and how that event is going to be created, managed. You know, it might be that as a small charity you're just going to take on one challenge event, it might be a mass participation event and get, you know, just, just doing that right, rather than try and do lots of different things and there's, you know, there's different ways you can go about it and it's going to be different for every charity. but I also want charities, you know, to think about creating their own events as well. Because with, with more and more challenge events being created, you got that you're going to need the aboriginal, you know, those events that stand out, are going to be important and those events that stand out for your charity. So if it's got a, you know, a twist to it that's actually specific to your Charity or your type of Charity, then, you know, that will all help. But that's, you know, that's a big, I know that's a big thing to take on.

Tim Beynon: I wanted to ask you about, about the whole, the whole accessibility issue around challenge events and something that's very important for us at the firefighter Charity. And I'm sure for a lot of charities that making sure that the things we offer to our supporters are accessible for as many people as possible. You've talked, you know, obviously personally, some of the challenges you've taken on, very physical challenges requiring a lot of fitness and you know, experience of that kind of thing, I could see how that puts a lot of people off the thought of potentially, you know, maybe this isn't for me because I don't have that Superhuman level of fitness. I've never taken on a 50 or 100 kilometre walk or run before, so I'm not even going to bother trying. I can see understand how a lot of people would think in that way. How can charities go about trying to make challenge events exciting, but also accessible?

Tracey Anne-Breese: I think that goes back to what I was saying about that, that twist to your Charity so know who your supporters are, what, what they need and incorporate that into, you know, the challenge events. it's difficult. A lot of the mass participation events will have, you know, accessible sections. I know, I mean one of my favourite events ever when we had our own business was facilitating a guy going

00:40:00

Tracey Anne-Breese: up Snowdon in the wheelchair with a team. I mean absolutely, you know, what I saw there, talking about teamwork was just absolutely incredible. we also had a three day event at the time which he asked if he could take part in and we were looking at how that could be, how we could make that happen, make some changes to the routes etc, and then Covid happened so, so that didn't happen unfortunately. But you know, again with events it's not always about, with for charities it's not always about the people taking part. Sometimes it's about your volunteer team and how they can get involved and what's stopping them, you know, getting involved in the event, as a volunteer supporting, you know, they might not be able to stand out and marshal on the same spot for four hours. So think about things like that.

Tim Beynon: How can charities also go about making sure that the costs of putting on a challenge event aren't prohibitive, especially for those smaller charities who might again might not even consider it because they assume that the costs are going to be too substantial.

Tracey Anne-Breese: Yeah, I mean that comes back to your business plan again, doesn't it? Your business case, your feasibility study, knowing what your capacity is, how many numbers, how many people, people you can have on the event, what the, at the entry fees might be, etc. Yeah, it's, you know, there's lots of things to consider. It would depend on and.

Tim Beynon: Sure. What would your advice be then? Perhaps for a Charity that's not put on a major challenge event before and is setting out their first challenge event that they're putting that sort of risk analysis together in terms of all the elements, and all the costs, all the insurance requirements and all the people requirements and things on the day and so on, what would your advice be to them? To not get freaked out by all that paperwork and administration and Due diligence that needs to be done to try and see the sort of bigger picture at the end of the day. How. What would your, what would their first step be? What would your advice be to them?

Tracey Anne-Breese: I think, I mean, for the first step, as far as I'm concerned, would be making sure the idea is feasible. So, so knowing that you are going to have a group of people that sign up to do that event, and then, and then break it down, you know, look at, I mean on the site there will be like, a draught event management plan that will have everything, all the headings in, so you've got all of your information in one place. and you know, involve other people. It's got to be about your team because that's where the best ideas are going to come for, from, for a start. but also, you know, share the workload. Yes, there is, there is a lot to go into it, but once you've done it once, then you'll know.

Tim Beynon: Is it worth also testing the waters with your supporters to see if they're likely to want to sign up in the first place? Because there's not, there's not much point putting a lot of work in if there's no appetite for it from them.

Tracey Anne-Breese: Yeah, I mean that, you know, to me that would all be part of the feasibility. Yeah, just study, just to talk to supporters, do some focus groups, get your volunteers in. You know, if you've got a group of regular supporters or if there's a, if there's a theme that people are talking to you about, I would quite like to do this. then, you know, bear that in mind when you're putting your ideas together.

Piers Townley: So this part of the show, Tracy, let us know how could charities get involved? This is a shout out. Where can people go then to find out more about, about the company.

Tracey Anne-Breese: So the website is challenge event experts.com that we're on. I'm on all over social media at the moment. I'm still testing what works best for me. so, yeah, Challenge Event experts, Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, TikTok is a new one. just trying to find that.

Piers Townley: That's largely witchcraft though, isn't it? TikTok, let's be honest.

Tracey Anne-Breese: Well, I think it's all witchcraft. You know, I put a post on LinkedIn on a friend's post today and said, you know, I don't. I've yet to be convinced that anybody that use social media isn't winging it because it's so unpredictable. Yeah, and obviously LinkedIn. So challenge event experts on LinkedIn as well.

Tim Beynon: Excellent. We'll put all the links in the show notes Tracy, so people can find all the details there. Tracy. Thank you, everyone, for joining us. It's been fantastic to have you on the show. We wish you all the very best with, challenge event experts, and we'll keep in touch and we'll keep track of your travels.

Tracey Anne-Breese: Fantastic. Thank you.

Tim Beynon: Really fascinating stuff there from Tracy. Really interesting conversation about challenge events. But talking of challenges, what's your next challenge going to? Bp? Has you got anything in the pipeline?

Piers Townley: Well, the last couple of years of the Brainstorm of Charity, we've ran our Snowden at Night challenge. And I've always kind of watched and done some press work for it and some comms work for it and never actually taken place. And, it's such a beautiful part of the country and such a magical thing to do with some incredible people. So 2025, I'm hoping to get my name down for Snowden at Night. Can't think of anything better. So that's. That's on my radar for. For a time ahead next year.

Tim Beynon: I like the sound of that. I like the sound of that. I haven't got anything necessarily in the pipeline other than the fact that I definitely do want to do another marathon. I've done one, did London in 2019,

00:45:00

Tim Beynon: and I haven't done another marathon since. But it is on it, definitely. I could feel. Feel the urge building. I definitely need to do another marathon at some point. I'm massively not fit enough for it at this stage, but, you know, definitely on the horizon. I think at some point. Another marathon for me at the moment, though, it's a challenge just getting out of bed in the mornings. It's so sort of dark and miserable and wet out there. It's like, that's a big enough challenge for me at the moment.

Piers Townley: I'm, going to be disappointed and I'm sure others can join me in this if you don't want it in costume as well. So, you know, no pressure. Not quite sure what that will look like, but I think you've definitely got to up this. Up the ante this time. It's a costume on this one.

Tim Beynon: Might have to let the listeners decide, you know, what do I. What would I do it dressed as? That could be a terrible, terrible mistake.

Piers Townley: No, that would be down to a boating boat face situation. Don't. Yeah, you choose it. We'll support you.

Tim Beynon: Yeah, okay, fair enough.

Piers Townley: So, in the spirit of Challenge Events. Let's take a look at our set to Superstar this week, Tim, and see if we can pick out a couple of people who've taken on a remarkable challenge or two over recent weeks. And don't forget, you can nominate your deserving colleagues, volunteers or fundraisers for a shout out too. Just email us@thecharityshowpodmail.com or get in touch through the links in the show notes.

Group of Grey Dippers challenge themselves to go swimming in freezing cold waters

So give us your challenge at Superstar for the week, Tim.

Tim Beynon: Well, it's not a superstar. It's a group of superstars. This, this week that I've picked out. and this is for a challenge event that I definitely wouldn't do. They're called the Grey Dippers and they're fundraising for a food bank in North Ayrshire. Now this is a group of guys, who basically voluntarily take it upon themselves to go swimming in like Baltically cold waters, up in Ardrossan South Beach. so they, they challenge themselves to see how many dips they can do in the freezing cold, sea, in order to raise money for charity and to raise money for this food bank. and they seem like a pretty insane bunch of guys, but you know, good, good luck to them. they are aiming this year to hit 250 dips, so 250 times that go into the water and freeze and come back out again. M. And they've already completed more, than 10% of that challenge already. and they want to raise, as much as they possibly can, and hoping to get the whole thing finished by Boxing Day. And interestingly on Boxing days they're doing this challenge between the 1st of November and Boxing Day, basically. And they're hoping on Boxing Day. They've said on Boxing Day we will complete the journey with a family and friends dip. Everyone is invited to come along and get involved. Now if I was a friend or a member of their family, ah, there's absolutely no chance that they would persuade me to do that. So good luck to all those friends and family who are, who are thinking about that as well. But really good luck to the guys because that's a, that's a hell of a challenge. Me and cold water don't go very well together. I struggle to get into the swimming pool, let alone, let alone the ocean. but there you go. What about you, Peter? You do you like bit cold water or. No?

Piers Townley: No, I'm not at all. There's a nice bath that's sitting out there. That's Just yet been used in my garden. My son uses it. But now I'm not dipping in there and I can vouch for the water in the dross and I know it very, very well, I swear. Near where my mum and dad live. So I've been up that area as well. It's flipping cold up there, so that is amazing. something.

Tim Beynon: Good luck.

Piers Townley: Watch from my dry robe on the side of the. They look at the banks.

Tim Beynon: I'd watch from the pub around the corner. I don't think I'd go in even close.

Colin Farrell's marathon challenge

Piers Townley: Oh, my. Superstar. Superstar. In fact, a well known name and a well publicised. It was Colin Farrell, the, actor who had raised €774,000, which is £644,000 for Deborah Island. Now, Deborah's a Charity that supports people with a rare skin condition. E.B. i'm, desperately trying to get this right. Epidermoleus bulosa EB or butterfly skin, the condition is called. And huge apologies if I pronounce that wrong, please do correct me. But anyway, so for Deborah Island, Colin ran the marathon, but for the last four kilometres he pushed his long term friend, Emma Fogerty in her wheelchair. Now, Emma's 40 years old and she's lived with this condition all her life. So for the last kilometre, it was one kilometre for every decade of her life that Emma has lived with this disease. And Colin, who was also born in Dublin, said, I've known Emma for many years and she epitomises bravery. She is what courage and pure determination are, ah, all about. So an amazing angle, amazing thing to do during the marathon in itself, for an amazing charity over in Ireland, for Deborah. So massive shout out there, Superstars status to a superstar challenge. So that's it for episode 13. Huge thanks to Saskia and everyone at NCVO and Akivo for taking a stand in regard to the impact of increased national insurance contributions for the sector. And, thanks also to Tracy for inspiring us to think about our next challenge. Time to get training, hey, Tim.

Tim Beynon: Well, I don't know about that, but yeah, we'll see how it goes. Just had to find a challenge to look forward to first. and in terms of things to look forward to, we've got lots coming up over the next few episodes. We're going to be taking a look at philanthropy and working with major donors, which should be really interesting. We're

00:50:00

Tim Beynon: also going to meet some young Charity ambassadors, talk to them, find out what, what they do and why they do it, and we're going to be talking to a sporting legend who's about to trek across the Sahara, so you can find out how that who that is pretty soon.

Piers Townley: And don't forget, you can be part of the show too. Just send us your voice messages or get in touch through any of the links in the Show Notes to share your stories and tell us what you'd like like us to cover in every episode.

Tim Beynon: We also want to know who your superstar fundraisers, volunteers, or colleagues are too. So head to the Show Notes and share their brilliance with the rest of us.

Piers Townley: And in the meantime, please follow or subscribe to us on your usual podcast platform and leave us a review, both of which will help others to find the show.

Tim Beynon: So that's it for another episode. Thanks for listening, take care, and we'll see you soon.

Tracey Anne-Breese: Sa.

00:50:45